This episode is sponsored by Lockton, click here to learn more
The Detroit Auto Show is coming to an end, but the conversations from day one at the Kettering University booth continue to inspire. Join host Jan Griffiths as she sits down with industry leaders and innovators shaping the future of automotive through fresh ideas, education, and collaboration.
First up, Dan Stewart from Automation Alley explains how bridging academia, government, and industry is sparking real progress in digital manufacturing. Enza Sleva from Kettering explains how their co-op program sets students up for success from day one.
Hajj Flemings talks about how AI is helping unlock creativity, while Ida Byrd-Hill shares her mission to make STEM education accessible to everyone. Scott Tobin breaks down the evolution of software-defined vehicles and what it means for the industry.
Dr. Ping Ren talks about additive manufacturing and its role in speeding up innovation in automotive design. Tarek Abdel-Baset explains why hydrogen could play a key role in sustainable transportation, and Dr. Diane Peters reveals how autonomous vehicles are transforming mobility for people with disabilities.
To close the day, Suzanne Petrusch passionately shares Kettering’s mission to fuel the industry with driven, problem-solving leaders ready to tackle the industry’s biggest challenges.
From tech innovation to education and bold ideas for the future, day one had plenty of great conversations. Ready for more? Check out day two here for more amazing conversations from the Detroit Auto Show!
Your Host
Jan Griffiths is the architect of cultural change in the automotive industry. As the President & Founder of Gravitas Detroit, Jan brings a wealth of expertise and a passion for transforming company cultures. Additionally, she is the host of the Automotive Leaders Podcast, where she shares insightful conversations with industry visionaries. Jan is also the author of AutoCulture 2.0, a groundbreaking book that challenges the traditional leadership model prevalent in the automotive world. With her extensive experience and commitment to fostering positive change, Jan is at the forefront of revolutionizing the automotive landscape. Reach out to her at Jan@gravitasdetroit.com
Featured guests:
Name: Dan Stewart
Title: Relationship Manager, Automation Alley
Discussed: [03:20] Bringing together academia, industry, and government, Dan explains how they’re helping small manufacturers embrace digital tools and thrive in Michigan’s automotive ecosystem.
Name: Enza Sleva
Title: Director of Career Development and Cooperative Experience, Kettering University
Discussed: [06:03] Kettering's unique co-op model, as explained by Enza, equips students with years of real-world experience, helping them hit the ground running in the fast-paced automotive industry.
Name: Hajj Flemings
Title: CEO & Founder, Rebrand Cities
Discussed: [12:21] AI isn’t here to replace us—it’s here to help us thrive. Hajj shares how embracing technology can unlock human creativity, transform leadership, and prepare us for the future of work.
Name: Ida Byrd-Hill
Title: CEO & Founder, Automation Workz
Discussed: [17:11] Ida shares how her programs open doors to STEM careers by providing tech certifications and opportunities for students outside the traditional university path.
Name: Scott Tobin
Title: CEO, Envorso
Discussed: [19:29] From managing millions of lines of code to over-the-air updates, Scott explains how the shift to software-defined vehicles is transforming the auto industry and the skills needed to keep up.
Name: Ping Ren
Title: Assistant Professor of Industrial Engineering, Kettering University
Discussed: [24:14] Dr. Ping Ren explains how additive manufacturing is transforming automotive design, enabling lightweight, complex products and faster prototyping to meet the industry’s need for speed and innovation.
Name: Jonathan Smith
Title: Senior Chief Deputy Director, Labor and Economic Opportunity
Discussed: [28:41] Jonathan shares Michigan’s efforts to align its rich automotive legacy with modern challenges to ensure young talent stays inspired, connected, and ready to solve big problems.
Name: Tarek Abdel-Baset
Title: Hydrogen Storage Systems Chief Engineer, FORVIA
Discussed: [33:10] Hydrogen is shaping the future of heavy-duty vehicles with faster refueling, lighter payloads, and seamless infrastructure—Tarek Abdel-Baset dives into how it complements EVs in the journey toward sustainable mobility.
Name: Diane Peters
Title: Associate Professor of Mechanical Engineering, Kettering University
Discussed: [39:38] Diane discusses her research on autonomous vehicles and how they can provide safe, tailored solutions to improve mobility and independence for people with epilepsy and other disabilities.
Name: Suzanne Petrusch
Title: Interim Vice President, Enrollment and Co-operative Services, Kettering University
Discussed: [44:47] Suzanne shares how Kettering University’s unique blend of academics and co-op experiences equips driven, curious students to become problem solvers ready to tackle the challenges of today and tomorrow.
Mentioned in this episode:
- The Detroit Auto Show
- Mobility Global Forum
- Michigan Department of Labor & Economic Opportunity
- Kettering’s Co-op program
- Start Your Admissions Process
- Detroit Auto Show 2025 - Day 2 - Kettering University
Mentioned in this episode:
This episode is sponsored by Lockton, click here to learn more
[Transcript]
[00:00:00] Jan Griffiths: Welcome to the Automotive Leaders Podcast, where we help you prepare for the future by sharing stories, insights, and skills from leading voices in the automotive world with a mission to transform this industry together. I'm your host, Jan Griffiths. That passionate, rebellious farmer's daughter from Wales with over 35 years of experience in our beloved auto industry and a commitment to empowering fellow leaders to be their best authentic selves.
Stay true to yourself, be you and lead with gravitas, the hallmark of authentic leadership. Let's dive in.
This episode is brought to you by Lockton. Lockton redefines business insurance and people solutions with a personal touch. Their global team of 11, 000 is driven by independence, not quarters. To tailor success for your business, discover the Lockton difference, where your goals become their mission.
Independence. It's not just how you think, but how you act.
We have two bonus episodes for you today. I'm recording live from the Detroit Auto Show in collaboration with Kettering University. I'll be recording from their booth in the AutoMobili-D ballroom and we have an amazing collection of guests for you to listen to. Interviews with Kettering faculty, interviews with speakers from the event, and interviews with simply interesting people that we found to get on the mic. The episodes will be split into two episodes, day one and day two. And in day one, you're going to hear from Dan Stewart from Automation Alley, Enza Sleva from Kettering University, Hajj Flemings who is the CEO of RebrandX, Ida Byrd-Hill from Automation Workz, and if you don't know what that's all about you're going to find out. And Scott Tobin, the CEO of Invorso, we're going to be talking about Software Defined Vehicles. And Dr. Ren, and she is going to be telling us about what Kettering is doing regarding additive manufacturing; she is leading the charge. And then, we have Jonathan Smith who works at the Department of Labor and Economic Opportunity. And Tarek Abdel-Baset from Forvia, he's going to be talking about hydrogen. We all have that question, right? Is it going to be battery or hydrogen? And then, we'll be talking to Dr. Diane Peters, as she shares some of her fascinating work in the world of autonomous driving. And then, we'll wrap up day one with Suzanne Petrusch from Kettering University and she is the Interim VP of Enrollment. So, let's get started with day one. Here we go.
And we're here today at the auto show at the Kettering University booth, and who just happened to come on by but Dan Stewart from Automation Alley, he is the relationship manager for the world of academia. Perfect timing right dan?
[00:03:36] Dan Stewart: Oh, I'm loving this every year. I look forward to this event.
[00:03:38] Jan Griffiths: Tell us more about what it is you do at Automation Alley, and why is it so important to have a relationship and alignment with a university like Kettering?
[00:03:49] Dan Stewart: Jan, the opportunity for academics at Automation Alley is to contribute to the conversation that is built around digital manufacturing, digital softwares, digital tools that will provide efficiencies for automotive manufacturing resources. What we do is we bring academia, industry, and government together to have a conversation around specific topics: it could be AI, could be cyber security, you name it. And what we do then is we parse out solutions that are digestible and relatable to small manufacturers across the great state of Michigan. We represent 4,000 of those manufacturers and we're trying to guide them in ways that will adopt these technologies.
[00:04:32] Jan Griffiths: Yeah, that's a great response. We are fresh off the atrium stage where Governor Gretchen Whitmer has just finished her opening speech. And one of the things that struck me about her speech was she talked about the automotive ecosystem. No longer we should refer to it as the automotive industry, it truly is the automotive ecosystem. And part of that ecosystem are organizations like Automation Alley and the world of academia, right?
[00:04:59] Dan Stewart: Indeed, yes. If academia is not included, there's so much research and there's so much development going on in that space around technologies that are nascent, that are evolving, that if academia is not part of that ecosystem that the automotive industry is trying to build and generate, then it's lacking something exceedingly important. They need to be part of that discussion.
[00:05:24] Jan Griffiths: Yeah. And, as you know, the Kettering model is very, very tightly tied to industry and students coming through Kettering have a deep understanding of industry before they step foot into their first job.
[00:05:38] Dan Stewart: Indeed, yes, Kettering is a member of Automation Alley and we're proud of that membership. So proud in fact that we're willing to publish their white papers and articles on our website and promote the university in a way that aligns with the automotive industry's need for academia.
[00:05:56] Jan Griffiths: Well, Dan, thank you for joining us today.
[00:05:58] Dan Stewart: All my pleasure, Jan.
[00:06:03] Jan Griffiths: And with me at the mic today is Enza Sleva and she is Director of Co-op Relations and Career Design, but she also has a deep history herself in the automotive industry coming from Ford Motor Company. So, Enza, tell us more about what you do at Kettering.
[00:06:21] Enza Sleva: I get to lead and connect, frankly, our great students with a lot of wonderful companies. We're very unique at Kettering that we provide this co-op experience, which is up to two and a half years of experience for the students. I get to see them flourish professionally, develop, and at the same time they're walking out with two degrees; I always tell everybody. They've got their academic, and then they've got this wonderful professional experience that they gain over their journey with the University at Kettering.
[00:07:00] Jan Griffiths: What is it about the Kettering model that makes it so unique?
[00:07:04] Enza Sleva: We are very different in that and unique, all of our students, 100 percent of them have to do at least five co-op terms. And that they're working with really wonderful, great companies, a lot of global iconic companies. They're alternating between academics and school. So, they're doing these 11 week sprints, these terms that are really, really fast. And so, half of the students typically are at work working for a great company and half are at school doing their academic term, and then they're going back and forth. And this goes on throughout their time at Kettering. When they're graduating, they've got this resume already that has sometimes multiple companies, certainly multiple years of experience, two and a half years already of professional experience that frankly makes our job easy from a career standpoint, career advising, because a lot of them are, you know, they're staying with their co-op employers. If not, they get opportunities right away because of the experience that they have, so it's very, very unique.
[00:08:22] Jan Griffiths: One of the things, Enza, that I like about the Kettering model that I think is needed now in the automotive industry more than ever before, and that is this idea of speed and integration. And when you have students coming out of the world of academia, there's a learning curve for them.
[00:08:39] Enza Sleva: Absolutely.
[00:08:39] Jan Griffiths: A very steep one to figure out how to operate in a corporate culture, how to get things done, how to get their ideas across. You have shortened that learning curve because they already know that. So, they are able to truly hit the ground running. And in the auto industry today, our biggest challenge is speed. It is integration and speed. It is connecting all the different stakeholders, all the different organizations, and making sure that we can operate at speed that we have never experienced before. And it seems to me like you're ahead of the curve.
[00:09:15] Enza Sleva: Yeah, we are. That's a really great point, Jan. When you're walking out of Kettering, you're graduating, and you've already acclimated to the culture, which is a big deal. You've done some of the jobs and so you can also move into, right? Some of even, I would say, you know, that kind of close to mid management, for example, right? But yes, you're not spending time as a company even having to now, right? On board, train, they're ready to go. And I will tell you also being, on the other side, being on the industry, what typically happens, what I had to do from an industry standpoint, I got maybe 10 to 12 weeks, maybe a look at a student. And then I had to bet, is this someone that we want to bring in? During that time, I haven't really seen them really take a lead in a project. Maybe leading a cross functional team, whereas with the co-op, that, I'm gonna say kind of dating, romancing, getting to know a bit of the culture, that happens freshman year of, you know, my university journey as a student. Meanwhile, I'm seeing as that corporate person, that industry person, I'm seeing this student develop, frankly, at a low cost proposition. And now, come graduation time, to your point, they're ready to go, really fast. I already know the talent I have and how I can position them, and it just puts me also from a company standpoint, ahead of the game. And so, that's why, like, our corporate partners also love this co-op, and they're literally on this just constant journey. Okay, I'm ready. I'm ready for that incoming freshman. Let's go. And they're starting, and you're right, and it fast tracks everything.
[00:11:11] Jan Griffiths: That's a great perspective but looking at it from a university perspective, which, you know, the world of academia. But I would imagine that it helps you keep your finger on the pulse of what industry actually wants because you've got these students coming back in telling you what they're experiencing, telling you what industry needs. And so, you're able to modify the curriculum if you need to because you're getting that almost real time feedback from employers.
[00:11:36] Enza Sleva: Yeah, absolutely. There's definitely great exchange of information that's going back and forth with every term. I will say, too, even our faculty there's a lot of ties to industry. We have quite a few of advisory boards too in the different disciplines that are constantly, right? They're connecting with our faculty. They're having those discussions, what do we need? What do we need here in this area? What do we need to fine tune here? So, absolutely that is very helpful, very critical. So, there is that great exchange of information for sure.
[00:12:13] Jan Griffiths: Thank you for joining me today.
[00:12:14] Enza Sleva: Yeah. Thank you.
[00:12:15] Jan Griffiths: And joining me at the mic today is Hajj Flemings. He is the founder of RebrandX and this is a man who knows a thing or two about innovation and AI. Hajj?
[00:12:32] Hajj Flemings: It is great to see you, Jan. We always run into each other, it seems like at Sweetgreen or Starbucks. And so, it's amazing to see you down here at the auto show.
[00:12:42] Jan Griffiths: Yeah. So, tell us, you are without a doubt, you are leading the charge when it comes to AI. You are also an expert in branding and to the name of your company, rebranding, but tell us how all that fits together around innovation. As you know, in the auto industry, innovation is a key part of what we do. How does all that merge together, Hajj?
[00:13:05] Hajj Flemings: So, I think one thing that people have to think about, if we look at the pandemic and we look at the release of Chat GPT, right? Our world, all of a sudden, changed and decades turned into weeks. And so, I think all of us had to rethink about how we're going to view life, whether it's the future of work, whether it's building an idea, it's relationships, it's how we're even going to get educated. I know we're here with Kettering University. What does education look like, right? And how do people prepare for a skill-based economy? And so, I think when I started to think about innovation as a person or as people, I'm always thinking about it from a human centric standpoint, and even when I look at AI, I don't believe that AI is going to replace people. Now, it can. But I think there's a part that the machine can't dream, right? That's the part that the human plays. And so, we're really about helping people find their place so that they can dominate and be elite in that, and be able to use technology because technology has always been an extension of human ability.
[00:14:16] Jan Griffiths: Yeah, I agree with you because sometimes people are afraid of AI. And you're right, it will take some jobs, yeah, maybe, but it allows us to really fulfill that human potential, the creativity that we have within us. Now, instead of being bogged down with more mundane tasks and spreadsheets and things that we have all around us in the auto industry, we can be creative. Can't we?
[00:14:40] Hajj Flemings: Yes. Yes. Because if we're all truly honest with ourselves, they're the part of the job that we never liked. Were people designed to work at a McDonald's for their entire life? I'm not knocking that job. What I'm saying is sometimes we end up in something because we think this is our purpose. So, now if you look at AI and look at the space that we're moving into, all the basic, mindless, repeatable tasks, those things are going to be pulled away. And what's going to be left? And I think it's going to introduce an entirely different level of creativity. So now there's some people who can move pixels and they can design stuff. But now your ceiling is your ability to be able to think as we begin to think about prompts and being able to communicate and speak to the machine to get the machine to be a servant to us, right? And so, I'm super excited about what the future looks like.
[00:15:39] Jan Griffiths: One thing that really comes to mind, Hajj, is the leadership and culture model that we need for the future is vastly different because now you don't need people to manage tasks. That's not what leadership and culture is or should be, it is about pulling people together, tapping into that level of creativity. Just like you said, making sure that AI works for us to support us. And that's a totally different leadership model and culture, isn't it?
[00:16:09] Hajj Flemings: It is. And then, I've been throwing this into there, you're going to start to look at more augmented work, you're going to start to look at there's going to be, and then this year, you're going to see such a movement in Agentic AI, right? If we go down this rabbit hole of robots, humanoids, I think by 2050, there's going to be 10 billion AI agents and there's going to be assistants. And so, at some point, humanoids and agents these things are going to have rights. Human rights. And so now you're not just competing against another human. And so, how do you as a leader figure out, "Okay, this can augment my work. Am I competing against it?" Because it's going to be a part of everything, right? So.
[00:16:58] Jan Griffiths: Yeah, totally different mindset. Well, that's great. Hajj, thank you so much for joining us today.
[00:17:03] Hajj Flemings: Well, I appreciate it. Thank you for the opportunity and I want to thank Kettering University.
[00:17:06] Jan Griffiths: And joining me at the mic today is Ida Byrd-Hill. Now, Ida is no stranger to Kettering. She has some exposure to GMI back in the day but what I absolutely love about what she is doing today is she is filling a niche area in the world of education for those students who perhaps can't afford or can't see their path to Kettering. Ida, tell us about that.
[00:17:39] Ida Byrd-Hill: Well, I'm excited because often times we kind of put what students should go into science, technology, engineering and math. And I say that every student right now has the ability to do so. They just do it at different levels. What we have discovered, that students who are avid video game players, while they may not be quote unquote your traditional engineering student, they have problem solving ability to be able to go into STEM. And so, we're filling that niche.
[00:18:08] Jan Griffiths: And how do you do that?
[00:18:09] Ida Byrd-Hill: We have tech certifications that we provide in AI, data analytics, cyber security ops, Internet of Things and Network Engineering, but they're mainly getting industry certifications like from Cisco, AWS, Microsoft, IBM, and we're taking them through that process of certification. Our programs are less than a year, but longer than six months, so they're getting really hands on digital skills, but how we identify them that's most unique.
[00:18:36] Jan Griffiths: That is great. And where are your students ending up?
[00:18:40] Ida Byrd-Hill: They ended up in automotive companies, healthcare companies, technology companies. They're growing through the AI, data, and cyber security jobs. We even had a few in the consulting firms because of their specialties.
[00:18:51] Jan Griffiths: That's great. It's an organization that's really focusing in on that area because the traditional path through university and into industry is not the path for everybody.
[00:19:03] Ida Byrd-Hill: No, in fact, it's only about 20%, 20 to 30 percent of the people who have the credentials right out of high school to go straight to a university like Kettering or any major university. But what happens to the other 70 percent?
[00:19:15] Jan Griffiths: Yes.
[00:19:16] Ida Byrd-Hill: And so, we deal with that other 70%.
[00:19:18] Jan Griffiths: I'm so glad that we met today and thank you so much for joining me at the mic.
[00:19:22] Ida Byrd-Hill: Thank you for the opportunity.
[00:19:28] Jan Griffiths: And joining me at the mic is Scott Tobin, he is the CEO of Envorso, and he is leading the charge of helping companies move into the world of software, particularly software defined product, and in our beloved automotive industry that is a software defined vehicle. So, a lot of these companies are moving from the world of hardware to software and this is where you play.
[00:19:52] Scott Tobin: That's right, Jan. We have a whole list of clients that have traditionally made products some of them over a hundred years; really good products, brands that you would know. Over the last couple of decades, software's crept in, right? Everything we do and touch has more software, and especially in automotive, not only is it becoming more software defined, meaning the software defines the customer experience, but they have to move to this architecture of software defined vehicles so the growth in software code is sustainable.
[00:20:24] Jan Griffiths: Yeah, we use this term software defined vehicle. We throw it around left and right, but I'm not sure that we really understand it.
[00:20:31] Scott Tobin: One of the best ways to understand is let's understand where we were before software defined vehicle, and we're not too software defined vehicle yet, Tesla is.
[00:20:39] Jan Griffiths: Yeah.
[00:20:39] Scott Tobin: Some of the startups are, but much of the industry is still on a journey. But what they have today is, I was in the industry myself for decades and every decade a little more software came in, and as the software came in, a new module came in and a new feature would come, a new module, some more software, and we put that together over decades to the point where Jan, there's over 120 modules in a vehicle now, and almost 150 million lines of code which is astonishing and it's really becoming unmanageable. It's all distributed. It's all canned network together or Ethernet or whatever the layout would be. But the point is, there's hundreds of modules exchanging thousands of messages. And this is really, as it grows, it's becoming hard to manage. And that's why you see software recalls growing at an almost exponential rate.
[00:21:28] Jan Griffiths: Yeah, that's true. They are, aren't they?
[00:21:30] Scott Tobin: They are. In fact, last year we just looked at the data, over 40% of the vehicles affected by recalls had a software component. Okay? Now, to be fair, some of those may have been using software to fix another problem, so it may not have been a root cause, but for example, the biggest one was the Tesla font size. Can you believe it? A font size in the cluster wasn't up to regulatory requirements, but because Tesla has software defined vehicle, they were able to over the year update it and the customers were only mildly, if at all, bothered. Right? Now a font is not going to wreck your day. A lot of them probably didn't even know it was an issue but the beauty is it didn't have to come into the dealership, no parts had to come off the vehicle, one over the air update, confirmed, done.
[00:22:12] Jan Griffiths: Yeah, and the cost impact of that is.
[00:22:15] Scott Tobin: 1.2 million vehicles. Could you imagine 1. 2 million vehicles coming into the dealership and being, I don't know, disassembled? It'd be brutal.
[00:22:24] Jan Griffiths: With this transition, Scott, that we're going through in the auto industry, is it changing the skill set that we need coming out of organizations like Kettering and others in the world of academia?
[00:22:37] Scott Tobin: It is, obviously. Any young people I talk to, if they've got the aptitude and any interest in software, I push them there. Firstly, it's a fascinating and fun space to work, right? But we need software engineers who understand the full stack, okay? So from the software that's on the silicone itself to the APIs up on top to where they build software to build the customer experience. Traditionally, the automotive software guys and gals have had, you know, very strong reliability and safety first solutions, FMVSS requirements, and obviously customer knowledge. If you couple that with what the tech companies are good at, right? They're good at rapidly evolving digital platforms, large platforms that are scalable and they're properly abstracted, and they can be updated through the life of the product. We all do it with our phones every week or so, right? New iOS update, new Android update. So, all products are moving toward that. But if you can get those skill sets, that core regulatory safety, 'cause you can't reboot your car at 80 miles an hour, like you do other devices, got to have that and then you got to have this big data piece, and if you can put those together and optimize those skills, and if the young people coming out can be aware they need to be knowledgeable and skilled and all those places, maybe they specialize in one, but if they understand the full stack, as we call it and the cloud, they'll be in good shape.
[00:24:05] Jan Griffiths: I love that. Scott, thank you so much for joining us today.
[00:24:07] Scott Tobin: Thanks for having me.
[00:24:14] Jan Griffiths: And joining me at the mic is Dr. Ren. Dr. Ren is part of the faculty at Kettering. Dr. Ren, welcome to the show.
[00:24:21] Dr. Ping Ren: Hi, nice to meet you.
[00:24:24] Jan Griffiths: Now tell me, what is it that you do at Kettering?
[00:24:28] Dr. Ping Ren: Hi everybody, so I joined Kettering in June 2023 and now I'm an assistant professor in the industrial and manufacturing department. Currently, I'm teaching the courses relative to the manufacturing and also do some research in additive manufacturing.
[00:24:45] Jan Griffiths: Now, manufacturing, as we all know, in our beloved auto industry, is a very important area of study. What changes are you seeing in the field of manufacturing? What are some of the new things that are coming into manufacturing?
[00:25:00] Dr. Ping Ren: So, since my exerpise is in additive manufacturing, which is kind of new technology rather than the other traditional manufacturing processes. Within the technology developments there is a high growing demands of the high customized products. And also we're looking for some lightweight and high compact products. So, we need some new technologies to achieve this kind of products. So, the traditional manufacturing processes or technologies cannot meet these requirements that's why a lot of industries are trying to introduce the additive manufacturing to achieve the high design freedom, high customized, and lightweight with also very strong properties in mechanical properties.
[00:25:45] Jan Griffiths: Can you share with us an example?
[00:25:47] Dr. Ping Ren: Yeah. For example, in automotive industry, previously we used the traditional manufacturing processes and we are struggling to do the complex designs. We are struggling with the lightweight products but now within the additive manufacturing we can do the complex geometries within a single manufacturing process which also had the lightweight and strong properties. And in that case we can reduce the assembly needs as well. It shows advantages in the racing cars or some high customized automobiles. And also beside the automobile itself, due to the smart system having an increasing demands in the automobile industry as well, the additive manufacturing also can do the prototyping. So, the engineers can do the prototyping before the mass production. They can do the task, they can change the design before the mass production, this is how the additive manufacturing change the automotive industry as well.
[00:26:58] Jan Griffiths: Yeah, you hit on a key point that we can really understand the design and change the design early on in the process. And as we all know, one of the most important aspects of the transformation in automotive today is speed. And it is looking at our design and manufacturing processes and looking at what we can do, how we can perhaps digitally or even using additive manufacturing methods, understand the processes and the product so that we can get that product and tweak it and get it into market as quickly as possible. So, what you're doing, I think, is critical and at the forefront of what we need in this industry.
[00:27:37] Dr. Ping Ren: Yes, that's correct. And also the students within the skills of the additive manufacturing can know how to do the design and how to change the design very quickly before the mass production as well. They learns a lot of things about the materials properties because it's also a very important thing for the additive manufacturing. This is a multidisciplinary area, it requires students not only learn the manufacturing itself, but also the mechanical engineering, the materials engineering, or even the electrical engineering, because they need this all multi disciplinary knowledge to do the additive manufacturing processes.
[00:28:19] Jan Griffiths: Yeah. And I'm sure there's a lot of automotive suppliers and OEMs out there right now that need this skill set. And I'm thrilled to know that you're leading the charge at Kettering to bring this into the curriculum. Thank you so much for joining us today.
[00:28:35] Dr. Ping Ren: Thank you.
[00:28:35] Jan Griffiths: And joining me at the mic is Jonathan Smith. Jonathan is with the state of Michigan Department of Labor and Economic Opportunity. Jonathan, welcome.
[00:28:49] Jonathan Smith: Thank you so much for having me.
[00:28:50] Jan Griffiths: What is it that you do?
[00:28:52] Jonathan Smith: I help work with the governor and the administration on issues related to workforce and talent and thinking about the role that the state can play in helping make sure that everybody in the state of Michigan has an opportunity to have a path to prosperity into a good paying career. In that, we're thinking about economic change in the ways that things might shift and be different in the future in Michigan and how we can be prepared for that.
[00:29:14] Jan Griffiths: In the governor's opening speech this morning, she talked about the automotive ecosystem. And I believe in that wholeheartedly in our beloved auto industry we have to look at it more holistically. And you're connecting not just OEMs and suppliers, but we're connecting this ecosystem, which is the world of academia, which is other institutions all working together to support not only the industry, but to support Michigan. That's quite a challenge.
[00:29:43] Jonathan Smith: It is. But if you think about what made Michigan a place during the 20th century, that was the most innovative and most prosperous state in the country. And frankly, one of the places that around the world was recognized as a place where you could come and you could, you know, get a job and move into the middle class and build wealth and prosperity for you and your family. One of the reasons that was true in Michigan was because we did have that interconnection. We had these amazing auto companies that were the Silicon Valley of their day. They were inventing all the coolest and most exciting technology, and they were leveraging the amazing research universities and other higher educational institutions, not just for their cutting edge research but for the talent that came out of those places. We still have all of this amazing legacy from that period. And really where we are today is how do we take these amazing institutions like Kettering and University of Michigan and community colleges around the state and all of this infrastructure that was built to support what at the time was an amazingly innovative and growing sector and redeploy it so that we're able to put that same infrastructure to work as the industry looks to the future and they think about, you know, adopting new technologies, whether that's on the energy side with batteries and electrics and hybrids, or whether it's on the software side and things like autonomous driving and some of the new software features that we know are going to be really, really valuable components of every car sold in the future. Being able to make sure that we're taking all of this amazing infrastructure that was part of our manufacturing heritage, our legacy, and realigning it and redeploying it towards the modern problems we are going to encounter as a sector that is really the critical goal for the state over the next few years.
[00:31:17] Jan Griffiths: And how do you see Kettering playing into this?
[00:31:20] Jonathan Smith: Kettering is an amazing institution, one that produces just a massive amount of talent that we need to capture. You know, we are 49th in population growth in the state of Michigan. The governor created a population council to make some recommendations to address that challenge last year. One of the things they focused on is we need to attract and retain young talented individuals, particularly those that have in demand skills like the graduates are coming out of your university and you know, how do we keep them here? You know, it used to be true that if you graduated with an engineering degree, you were going to move to Detroit because it was the most exciting place in the world to work. But now, your graduates have options. They can go to California, they can go to Texas, they can go anywhere and work in the auto industry and do amazing engineering work. So, how we keep them here is by partnering with Kettering and partnering with other ecosystem partners to make sure that what we're offering is not just a good job, but a good quality of life, and a sense of mission. You know, young people want to feel like they're solving big problems in the world. If you think about whether it's climate change and the role that the transportation sector plays . But if you think about, you know, increasing mobility for folks who have a disability or, you know, are having a hard time moving around the world, like there's so many big societal problems that we can solve through mobility solutions. And so, you know, making sure that Michigan is seen as a place where if you're a young person, you know, you can get an amazing degree, but you can stay and live and pursue a career that is going to be not just a lucrative career, but one that is rewarding and gives you a sense of mission and purpose that is the goal that I think, you know, we have to create. And we really need to partner with institutions like Kettering to make sure we understand, you know, what is it that your students are coming out when they graduate, what is it they're hoping to do? And how can we form those strong bonds when they're here to keep them here?
[00:32:58] Jan Griffiths: Yeah. Well, I'm all in. Let's transform this industry together, shall we?
[00:33:02] Jonathan Smith: Sounds like a great idea.
[00:33:03] Jan Griffiths: Thank you for joining us.
[00:33:04] Jonathan Smith: All right. Thanks for having me.
[00:33:05] Jan Griffiths: Joining me at the mic today is Tarek Abdel-Baset from Forvia. Welcome.
[00:33:15] Tarek Abdel-baset: Thank you, Jan, for having us. Glad to be here.
[00:33:17] Jan Griffiths: Now, why are you here at the auto show today? What are you doing?
[00:33:20] Tarek Abdel-baset: So, today I just gave a talk on why hydrogen? So, hydrogen is a player in the automotive space. And in our company, we are invested heavily in hydrogen storage systems for mobility spaces. So, I came today to give a speech as to why hydrogen and why would you consider that potentially as an alternative to, say, an electric vehicle or in combination with say, an electric vehicle.
[00:33:42] Jan Griffiths: If you were to boil it down to three points, why hydrogen? I know thats tough, right? I can see you rolling your eyes like, oh no. Three points, come on.
[00:33:53] Tarek Abdel-baset: So, a couple things. So, on larger vehicles, lighter and you can go farther, okay? So you have more payload, more distance, and quicker charging compared to a battery. So, that's on the vehicle itself, why you would want to do that. So, we see it really trending more towards the large vehicles, Class 2 and up. For those reasons, you can literally just pack more into a space without as much weight as a battery, and you can fill it almost as quickly, say, as a traditional diesel or gas vehicle, whereas a battery that huge on a Class A vehicle, hours. So, the experience to the traditional gas and diesel type vehicle feels very similar, fairly seamless kind of changeover whereas the electric vehicle on something that large, the idea of going down to charge large fleet vehicles, etc., that could become a bit of a problem if you have to lose a shift, say, for example. Payload, on Class 8 vehicles, that's dollars lost if you're losing payload because you have a heavy battery. So, with hydrogen, that penalty is much smaller. So, again, it looks more like the traditional experience fleets we are used to today. So, that's where in the mobility space where we really see it happening. And then, on the infrastructure side, same reason when you're trying to move a lot of energy quickly by filling up vehicles, when you look at say a Class 8 vehicle, you're moving ten times more energy than you were, just say, a passenger vehicle. So it's not negligible the amount of energy you need to move quickly from one place to another to get it onto the vehicle. In a lot of places, in a lot of circumstances, the electric grid could struggle with that. There's a solution for everything obviously so it's not a hard rule but we see that if you really want to fill large trucks quickly without really stressing the grid, hydrogen is a good alternative to that.
[00:35:37] Jan Griffiths: How do you refuel?
[00:35:40] Tarek Abdel-baset: So, it looks very similar to a normal gasoline pump today. So, you pull up to the fueling station. It looks like you have your same stall. You have that big box in front of you, right? With the counter and everything on it. You pull out a hose and a nozzle that looks very, very similar and this is for what we call pressurized hydrogen. You pick up a nozzle, it feels and looks very similar to the experience today. You walk up to the side of your vehicle, open the cap, and plug it in, and it locks in. There's a handle that you push just like you would with a gas handle and it locks that connection in and you start moving hydrogen. And most vehicles will fill, you know, a light duty vehicle filled 5 to 10 minutes. Some of the protocols we're working on now for heavy duty vehicles that we're trying to obviously still do 10 minute fills, but moving, you know, 10 times more hydrogen. But the idea is that in 10 minutes in most, you know, applications, you're going to fill up your vehicle and you know, you disconnect, put the thing back on the box and you drive away. So the experience is meant to really mimic what we have today to the customer.
[00:36:42] Jan Griffiths: It sounds a little bit more robust than an EV charging station, because we hear so much today around the problems with EV charging. There aren't enough of them. And if you do pull up, the chances of them being damaged is pretty high and inoperable. It sounds like from what you're telling me that the hydrogen infrastructure that's required is much more robust. And I'm thinking it would, like you say, it mimics what's in place already. So, it's not so much of a dramatic change, is it?
[00:37:12] Tarek Abdel-baset: Electric infrastructure has its pros when we talk about electric versus hydrogen, we're very careful now to not be like we were, you know, 10 years ago, when it was hydrogen versus electric. It was a battle. We would butt heads. We think it's really complimentary right now. So, light duty, definitely, you know, with electric it is a simpler infrastructure for sure than with hydrogen. You're moving a gas, it is a little bit more complicated to move a gas around. So, it's not a trivial station to build a hydrogen station but, in the end, the experience is fairly, you know, seamless to what you have today. But electric also you can do high power, you know, fast charge, low charge. There's electricity everywhere so electricity has its place, but when we're getting into these bigger vehicles, when we're getting into large amount of vehicles, you know, say on a highway fueling station where you got a high throughput the logistics of running that obviously, not just the queues of lines of vehicle, but getting that energy through. One of the examples kind of just to put it in context is when you think of the amount of energy flowing through just a traditional gas station today, just your typical corner store gas station with a normal amount of traffic, the amount of energy that you're moving on board in terms of gasoline moving to the vehicles, it's the same as powering like a large football stadium in terms of electricity. So, you think of that amount of energy concentrated in that space, you're moving a really a lot of energy. So it's not trivial, right? When you're moving electricity, that amount of electricity, not trivial. Moving a lot of energy in the form of hydrogen, gets a little bit simpler than moving a lot of electricity fast. So that's where we think it's gonna make sense, you know, once adoption rates of electric vehicles, electrified vehicles takes off.
[00:38:55] Jan Griffiths: I can tell that you're passionate about the subject and you are all in. And I think what you need is some talented students from Kettering University to support you in your mission. What do you think about that?
[00:39:05] Tarek Abdel-baset: Absolutely. We're always looking for good talent and that's one of the things we'd like to do with outreach. Anytime we're looking to work with a university on a kind of a research program, there's always that element of, you know, what are we doing for talent recruitment? Part of every kind of engagement that we have with any kind of academic institution. So, yeah, I've worked with Kettering in the past, great students, so always always open to it.
[00:39:29] Jan Griffiths: Great. Well, thank you so much for joining us today.
[00:39:31] Tarek Abdel-baset: All right. Thank you, Jan. Appreciate it.
[00:39:37] Jan Griffiths: Joining me at the mic is Diane Peters. Diane is indeed part of the faculty at Kettering University. Diane, welcome.
[00:39:45] Dr. Diane Peters: Thank you.
[00:39:46] Jan Griffiths: What do you do at Kettering?
[00:39:47] Dr. Diane Peters: Well, I do a lot of things. Obviously, I teach courses, I do research, and some of my research and teaching is focused on autonomous vehicles, which is one of the main things that a lot of people are really getting into in vehicle technology right now.
[00:40:02] Jan Griffiths: What's going on in the world of autonomous vehicles from your perspective?
[00:40:05] Dr. Diane Peters: Well, there's a lot of things going on. Obviously, there's a lot of different pieces. I come at it from the controls and simulation perspective from mechanical engineering. There's also a lot of sensors. There's a lot of integration. There's also a lot of social considerations here. People are asking a lot of questions like, why do I want an autonomous vehicle? Some people like to drive, but there are a lot of advantages, you might have seen various publications where people talk about reducing driver fatigue, reducing crashes, reducing congestion. But one of the other things that's really interesting is that autonomous vehicles have the possibility of making life a lot better for people with a lot of disabilities who simply can't drive right now.
[00:40:46] Jan Griffiths: Give me an example.
[00:40:47] Dr. Diane Peters: Well, one example of that would be epilepsy. If somebody has uncontrolled epilepsy and they are actively having seizures, then they cannot get a driver's license and the amount of time that they have to be seizure free varies by different states. But the simple fact is that if somebody has a seizure every few months, they simply can't get a license, and that limits them tremendously. And so, if done right and if done in accordance with what they need, autonomous vehicles have the possibility to do a lot for people.
[00:41:20] Jan Griffiths: I love that because it opens up a whole new world of mobility for people who otherwise couldn't go anywhere.
[00:41:26] Dr. Diane Peters: Oh, absolutely. There are a lot of things that need to be considered, though, in order to make these vehicles really a good thing for people with epilepsy. I've actually got a current research project on that. It's still in its early stages, and I'm collaborating with the Epilepsy Foundation of Michigan, who's been a great partner, and it's focused on really figuring out what needs to be done. So, a couple of the key questions are, first of all, is just making these vehicles autonomous enough? Or is there something else? And the answer is there is something else. And also, what about steps short of full autonomy? SAE has levels of autonomy that they've defined. Do we have to go all the way to level five before it's useful for people with epilepsy? Or could we go to a lower level and still make it safe for them to drive? And the answer is perhaps with enough research they could. So, one of the main things that's coming out of this is that you have to be able to figure out what to do if a person has a seizure in the vehicle, and that involves the detection phase of it, how do you know it's happening, and then it's going to be a different action depending on the person. For some people, really it doesn't need to do much, it'll be over in a moment and they'll be fine. For other people, maybe it needs to contact a family member, a spouse, a parent. And for other people, it might actually need to go to the ER. So, figuring out how to integrate that intelligence into the vehicle is something that's going to have to be done.
[00:42:55] Jan Griffiths: You know, Diane, as I think about autonomous, initially people think it's like a cool thing to have, right?
[00:43:00] Dr. Diane Peters: Yes.
[00:43:01] Jan Griffiths: But listening to you, it's much more than that. You have the ability to truly impact somebody's life in a very deep and meaningful way, and I think often we don't think about that, do we?
[00:43:13] Dr. Diane Peters: I think that that's actually very true. If you think about what mobility means to people, it means being able to do your own shopping, which seems like such a small thing. Going to the grocery store, it's no big deal. Well, yes, actually, it is. Being able to see friends, being able to be social with others not being limited to being dependent on others or just being in your own home. It really opens up the world and Increases people's quality of life. And it also has an economic impact. There are a lot of very smart, talented people who perhaps can't hold down a job because they don't have reliable transportation that works for them. And then, of course, getting to medical appointments in order to keep this condition under control is also extremely important. So, there's a lot of ways that it could impact people in a very positive way. Both the people with epilepsy, people with similar disabilities because there are other things that could draw on the same kind of technology and their family and their friends and their communities and even going on to society as a whole.
[00:44:19] Jan Griffiths: I am so glad that you're the one leading the way on this very important field of study and research. There's so much more that we could tear into Diane, but I have to say thank you so much for joining us today.
[00:44:34] Dr. Diane Peters: Oh, you're welcome. And I would be happy to come back sometime and talk further on it as this work goes on, if you'd like.
[00:44:40] Jan Griffiths: Yes, of course. Thank you.
[00:44:41] Dr. Diane Peters: Thank you.
[00:44:47] Jan Griffiths: Joining me at the mic today is Suzanne Petrusch. Suzanne, welcome.
[00:44:50] Suzanne Petrusch: Thank you so much, Jan. It's such a pleasure to speak with you today.
[00:44:53] Jan Griffiths: Now, you work at Kettering university. What do you do?
[00:44:57] Suzanne Petrusch: I do. I am serving as the Interim Vice President for Enrollment and Cooperative Services. I've been in my role since July of 2023.
[00:45:06] Jan Griffiths: And what does that entail?
[00:45:07] Suzanne Petrusch: I have the most exciting position in that I get to see students throughout their life cycle, from the time they might be young students coming in for a pre-college program, a camp, perhaps in programming or in robotics, to participating in competitive robotics as high school students. And then, all of the traditional recruitment activities that we do from college fairs and meeting students in their home markets, in their high schools, talking about the value of a Kettering education, through to the admission process, reviewing their credentials, and making sure that they're prepared to tackle the rigors of a Kettering degree. Making sure that Kettering is an affordable possibility through our Office of Financial Aid, which includes our scholarship programs. And then, as they progress throughout their time at Kettering, they're going to be in required cooperative education experiences. I have the privilege of getting to work with our cooperative services team, so co-op positions and career design, so that we're looking at the long term career opportunities for students. So really from one end of the spectrum to another.
[00:46:10] Jan Griffiths: Suzanne, there's a lot of debate over a college education these days. What are your thoughts on that?
[00:46:17] Suzanne Petrusch: I feel so grateful to be with Kettering University at this time when the public questions the value of higher education. And we see stories certainly in education media, but I think you see them throughout other types of press as well, about institutions that are closing, institutions that are merging, and Kettering is uniquely positioned to demonstrate return on investment, that is return on investment of students time, the financial investment that they make, because of the portfolios they develop and the proven success in their co-op positions, and in gaining full time employment following graduation. It is a model that is being clamored for at many levels. We are doing that in Flint, Michigan for our students. And I think that this is a model that can be followed by many other institutions, but I love that we're able to do this and I want more people to know about this Kettering experience.
[00:47:14] Jan Griffiths: Yeah, I can tell that you're really passionate about it, right?
[00:47:17] Suzanne Petrusch: Truly.
[00:47:18] Jan Griffiths: When a student comes into Kettering? What really lights you up about a student?
[00:47:24] Suzanne Petrusch: Well, we talk about for the driven, so our students tend to be laser focused on what their interests are. And because of our history as the General Motors Institute, people often associate Kettering only with the automotive industry. And while it's wonderful to be here at the Detroit Auto Show, yes, we have that track record in the auto industry, but there are many other areas. So, when we're looking at a student and having that conversation with somebody who might be interested in Kettering, we want to know that they have a purpose, that they see themselves working and gaining practical experience that they marry with their academic work. So, theory and practice together. And often what undergirds that is a curiosity, so it might be a curiosity about the future of EVs, or it could be about other forms of mobility, but it might be about cybersecurity, artificial intelligence. It could be about management in any number of tech industries. That curiosity and that quest for innovation will often drive them to want to find solutions to problems. So, we're looking for problem solvers, curious problem solvers who want to make a difference.
[00:48:33] Jan Griffiths: Yeah, and that's exactly what Governor Whitmer said in her opening speech this morning. She said, "We need to solve problems." That's what we're all about. We've been doing it for decades in Michigan, and we need to continue to do it. Thank you, Suzanne, for joining me at the mic today.
[00:48:47] Suzanne Petrusch: Oh, it's been a pleasure. I so appreciate the opportunity and would welcome the opportunity for people interested in Kettering, whether at the undergraduate level or graduate level, to come on to our website at www.kettering.edu to learn more, and my team would be more than happy to work with them to answer any questions.
[00:49:06] Jan Griffiths: Thank you.
[00:49:07] Suzanne Petrusch: You're welcome. Thank you.
[00:49:12] Jan Griffiths: And that's a wrap from day one at the Detroit Auto Show! Stay tuned for part two of these bonus episodes and day two of the Detroit Auto Show, and we'll be hearing from more Kettering staff: Dr. Jacqueline El-Sayed, she is the brand new CEO of SAE International; the one and only Jennifer Dukarski from Butzel, she'll be giving us a different perspective, a legal perspective on AI. We have Alisyn Malek from Middle Third, who'll talk All about her new program, Changing Lanes, for those Kettering alum, who might be thinking about moving out of the corporate world and getting involved in a startup. Stay tuned. And Jose Flores, our young millennial CEO; and Ted Serbinski, and we'll also be hearing from David Glover with the student perspective. So stay tuned.
Thank you for listening to the Automotive Leaders Podcast. Click the listen link in the show notes to subscribe for free on your platform of choice, and don't forget to download the 21 Traits of Authentic Leadership PDF by clicking on the link below and remember. Stay true to yourself, be you, and lead with gravitas, the hallmark of authentic leadership.